I've been thinking on this one lately .....
An Online Needlework Store is currently hosting a well Needlework competition. You submit your pieces and everyone votes on which piece they like the best and there are prizes. Each piece is listed anonymously on the website.
On one of the email lists, a lurker pipes up and says "my pieces are numbers X and Y. Vote for me".
In my oh so tactful manner I mentioned I thought this was tacky, gauche and not in the spirit of the competition.
One of the moderators (I think) on that group shut the thread down immediately.
On another list that I was part of (and many of you are still part of) there were various non-stitching competitions including, vote for my hospital for an MRI and vote for my dog so I can win an ipod.
Now I gotta agree with the hospital one. I did vote for that. But I did it because I thought it presented the best case for needing one.
This is going to sound sooo naive but when did competitions become about "who can canvas the most votes" rather than "which piece is best".
In the first or second year of Big Brother in Australia you had a whole state voting for one person because she was the only contestant from that state.
A radio station last year was giving prizes to people who voted the most times for a contestant in some celebrity dancing reality show.
I am well aware I am pushing again the tide with this one, but is it really so wrong to go back to "best item wins" especially if the entries are listed anonymously?
Honest answers please people - I can handle the criticism and I know you will give me food for thought on this one ....
Am I being unnecessarily idealistic? By being so, am I creating unnecessary conflict?
Stephen, this is similar I think to the ethics of cricket conversation we had the other week .... and again I am coming down on the side of idealism I think.
OK people - sling it at me - show me why I'm wrong :) :) :)
41 comments:
Mel,
I saw that post, and your response. I personally thought what she did was distasteful too. I guess I feel this way because she came out of lurkdom to ask for votes. It's not like she said to a close friend I have a piece in the contest. She solicited a group of strangers. And to tell the truth I voted for the ones I thought best...which weren't hers. I'm on your side with this one Mel!
I also agree with you on this one, Mel. I think it has to do with the commercialism of our society. Now, even our opinions are disposable. We will throw them away at anything or anyone who tells us to. We do not make our own decisions, simply agree with what the media (broad use of media here) tells us to agree with. It really devalues our opinions in the end. Each person's vote is worth less because they are bought and sold.
I never go and vote for anyone who asks for it, although I did do the hospital one too. I guess that means I feel the same way you do......
Of course you have a very valid point..AND I'm in total agreement. Yes, I voted on the Hospital one... Maybe even the dog one ... BUT I also went to the site of the stitchery and took a look AND I voted... AHA but not the one asking for it. I much preferred one of the others.... Fact, since I was given three choices I voted for two others. I would hope that if I have an stitched entry in a competition I'd be able to win because I presented a very good piece AND not because I asked for and was able to "drum up" as many people as possible to vote on my piece just because it was mine. Competitions are about quality not who knows more people. I DO have a bit of a disgruntlement on the online competitons... We all know how poorly stitched pieces show up on our monitors so how can we really judge the quality of a stitched piece just by seeing it online? OR is that just me that thinks that way? I'd much prefer, if I had to be a judge, to be able to see the piece up close and in person. In a way I'm sorry, now, that I even went to vote because basically I think I voted for the main piece because I liked the picture...not really knowing how the stitching really looked....
I voted for the MRI, too, but that was mainly because it's in the same state that I live in, and do drive through the area on occasion; should the need arise, I would hope to have the necessary equipment available. But also, on my home computer, I voted for one in my home state, which didn't even come close. But that was a worthy cause for a piece of equipment - if three were given away, all three would be the same, though the hospitals in need would, of course, be different cases.
As to voting on a piece of needlework (I saw the post, too, but ignored it - I don't have all day to follow links from people I don't know), if it was my best pal, sure, I'd give them a vote - not necessarily all of my votes, depending on the other pieces up for vote. But I want to support my pals, so some thought goes to them. When a complete stranger drops in, lobs a "vote for me" grenade, then heads back out, well, that's just not cool. And if she was very friendly with some people on the group, I would just ignore it like I did - I don't know if she's got a group of pals in there, or not - if so, I'm sure they'll vote for her. But maybe not all of their votes - depends on her work, I would hope. In which case, a private e-mail to those folks would have been the better option - but some people have no couth.
So to sum up, I agree with you 100%.
I'm behind on email, but I think I saw the subject of the post. And I pretty much agree with what's been said already. I ended up blocking emails from a friend's wife because she was constantly asking for votes in this or that online competition, and also because she really didn't have much sense of where she went online and was constantly picking up the latest virus....
Wow !!!!! While I appreciate the validation of my beliefs I was expecting *someone* to disagree - even just by playing Devil's Advocate!
Thanks for this Natalie - this is a topic I've discussed over coffee many times.
The things is, and here's where I'm out of step with modern society, is I read a report, somewhere which referenced a number of sociological studies, that said that people want less choice.
Their finding is that people do not want to choose between 20 brands of item x - they want to choose between two. That modern society contains too many choices and these choices are overwhelming and thus we as a society crave people to make most of the decisions for us, or at least minimize the choices available.
Apparently supermarkets have taken this to heart - that's why in Australia you have only two major brands to choose from for your mayonnaise or dry cat food.
Now living on my own, I can tell you there are times when I wish there was someone else who could occasionally decide what to make for dinner, but that in no way extrapolates out to what this study is saying.
Just wish I could recall the title of the study or link to it.
Thoughts anyone ????
Oooh look out Nancy - that's a slippery path :) You don't want to go agreeing with my stance on everything - I have some pretty weird ideas :)
We don't. So we judge it on other criteria. Personally I look for the individual touches - have they personalized it in some way, put it on a hand dyed fabric or changed the floss - in a way that makes it better!
Did you see any pictures that made you think "oooh I wish I'd have thought of doing that" or "gee I really want to stitch that now". That's the criteria I use for online comps. Just thoughts and looking at it a different way ....
LOL !!! Leave it to me to open my gob where others used discretion :)
I gotta admit (and I'm sorry Marc) but I stopped reading TheSamplerLife because at one point there there were more posts about these (non-stitching) online comps than there were actual stitching posts.
To me these competitions, especially the "win an ipod" sort seem to be more about making a quick buck for the advertiser than any genuine form of displaying talent. I can't see the difference between these and the mega quintillions the phone companies make off reality television.
AND I certainly don't blame you for not reading TheSampler Life or any other group that has so much non-stitching talk. On TSL I've never limited OT but I surely wish that members WOULD label their posts as OT when it is not about stitching...that would make it so much easier for so many members who just don't have the time to wade through so much traffic that is generated by many of the larger groups. BUT then I'm just as guilty not labeling something OT when I should....
Before I go and see what other said: I'm with you, Mel. I think it's greedy and dishonest to beg for votes, unless you're a politician, I suppose, that's what election campaigns are for after all, and unless you're doing it for a charity reason.
I don't mind it so much if no money or prizes are involved. But still hurts my natural modesty :-)
Over all it's just another of those things where ethics and morals are vanishing completely and are replaced by selfishness and greed.
I had a huge issue with my SIL, back when her daughter was still almost a toddler... every time she offered the kid something she offered her a choice of at least four or five items. I told her that she wouldn't help the kid choosing this way and that she shouldn't offer her more than two things, but she never understood that. And she is a professional in the field of education, having taught Kindergarten and studied for higher education degrees. *I* never understood why she didn't notice she completely confused the girl. She probably thought her daughter was so intelligent, she would get it very quickly...
I'm with you Mel. This is just dishonest to canvas for votes. We have put far to much emphasis in modern life on success without morals and it really bugs me. It is just so pointless. I agree entirely that we have to much choice. BTW, we have a state of maind in England that comes with age - it's called Grumpy and I am very proud to be one. We question everything that we find pointless and this state of mind comes with age. Be proud, you are soooooo right on this one
Actually I *prefer* to have a lot of choices - I am not a five year old :) I understand for limiting choices for children - but as adults ??? Imagine of we had to choose between only two manufacturers of floss for our stitching ???
And yes Roseanne I have been proud to being called a "Grumpy Old Woman" ever since the first series with the men :) :) :)
Hi Gothy I am behind you 100% I went no-mail on a group because one person kept canvassing for this competition or that competition and when the list owner mailed me (because she noticed I wasn't posting) I explained why. She then looked carefully at the posts and over 50% in the previous 3 months had been this one person and competitions. She asked her to cease and desist or leave. She left.
Yes, of course! But - because so many people today are just tv-junkies without any brains they're overwhelmed :-)
I will join your Grumpy Old Women club! Loads of things to grump about in my book!
I agreed with you. It was not in the spirit of the competition. One thing it did come out her post though was to remind me of the competition. I knew Karen was hosing it and I was going to come back and check the entries.
I didn't vote for anybody though. Like Marc said, it's too hard to judge a stitching from the monitor. I can't believe there were so many Midsummer Night Fairy there. I got her all kitted up and now make me itching to start her.
was thinking the same thing when browsing the entries, I stitched that one for my niece for a wedding present. She picked it out because it looked like one of her tatoos!!! LOL
And now that I am on this page and not my Multiply inbox, can someone tell me why I have only gotten notice on a couple of these replies?? I had to read all the rest directly from this page. I thought I get noticed of ALL replies where I have posted a comment.
Oh, I am so with you!!!! Lately everything seems to be a popularity competition and it just sickens me. So few things lately allow for honesty and integrety anymore. I refuse to jump on the bandwagon just because "everyone" is casting votes for this cause/competition or that one. So many things aren't about who has the best offering, just who can amass the most votes. When I do cast a vote for something, its because *I* like it, not because someone asked me to. Yeah, if a good friend of mine told me they had entered a competition, I would look at their entry, and more than likely vote for them because I wanted to support them, unless I was only allowed one vote and there was something I truly felt was more deserving.
I got annoyed this morning when I saw people "defending" this women and I spoke up. I told everyone the problem was she posted on a few groups about this and it's the only thing she ever posts on those groups. No responses yet...
I hate being asked to vote for stuff in public competitions. If I do go to the site, I look at the other entries and vote for what I like best. So often if a person is asking me to vote for them, I instead vote for their competition. Not out of spite, but because their entry is not the best. And they know it, which is why they canvas for votes. If it was fair, I would vote. Such as competitions on one of my groups or in a blog only. Those I enjoy.
OK how do I put this coherently. It seems to me, that if you have this blog page sitting open, then you wont receive an email to say there's a new entry on it.
If you already have an unread email saying there's a new entry, then it wont send you any more emails about this page, until you have visited the page again.
Thanks Lyne - the only concern is that its unclear whether you complaining about her or me :) :) :) :)
Thanks for speaking up though!
Hmmm - you know I wonder how many people who "seem" to be on the bandwagon actually secretly do this.
The amount of people I know who, when drunk, confessed that they voted for our last Prime Minister .... I stopped getting people drunk - it was scaring me too much.
Not complaining about you!!!!!
Oooh Rosanne and I thought I was the only one. My ambition in life has always been to grow old disgracefully. To say what I think and do what I like (within reason of course). These online competitions where everyone canvasses for votes are a complete pain in the ...... and like others I find I just delete whole digests on groups where they continually plead for votes.
Honest competitions seem to be a thing of the past. Even the flower and horticultural shows are rigged (and I could tell a tale or two about those) You are right Mel. I agree with you
I think, because many of the replies are posted pretty closely, that you will eventually get another notice with several on it. I expect multiply only polls every 20-60 minutes, so if 4-15 replies all get posted in that space (however long it might be), you won't get every individual one. It's a process that runs in background, and when it runs, it picks up everything that has changed since the last time it ran. Of course, this is all assumption on my part, based on how my systems at work pass data to and fro...
rosanneduk wrote
'success without morals'
Rosanne said a mouthful in those three words.
Possibly because from one time you're on your site to the next multiply just sends a post about the first one received after you left - then again when you come online the next time and more replies have come up, you will again be notified of the first reply since your last visit (usually mentions how many more replies have come in since then)
A further update! Just received this note from Karen:
http://www.thestitchingpost.com.au/voting.htm
There was more but I'm not going to post it on an open blog post. Lets just say Karen is feeling very hurt and upset over the sheer nastiness some people have displayed towards her and her husband and their business over this competition.
I don't udnerstand why they would be nasty to the shop - it's not their fault people are "cheating"
As Karen said, she did not specifically list "asking strangers to vot e for you" as being against the rules.
However other people have other ideas. As can be seen by the post that started this blog entry, *I* consider it cheating. However other people are doing the "if you don't remove the cheaters we will never use your business again" ploy to *force* Karen and her husband to follow their ideas of what is and is not cheating.
I could do a whole blog rant on this. How dare anyone else threaten a small business because your ethics in a tiny competition were violated. Simply do what I did - blog about it and move on. Its her shop, its her right to hold any damn competitions any way she wants .....
On heck - tooo tired to do a proper rant - fill in the rest of it yourselves, you know how it goes :) :) :) :)
Just further proof that people are a$$holes.... It's too bad she got all that grief over something so minor. Maybe she should revisit the rules before/if she tries this again?
She is not currently considering do this again - EVER!
100% in agreement with you on this. As for threatening to withdraw business over others behaviour is just so childish. I really feel for Karen and her husband as they should not have to put up with this kind of immature, greedy and unethical behaviour. My blood is boiling over this now. Before I was gently steaming!
No one can blame her either!
Most people are by nature competitive. That's a fairly healthy thing and any Darwinian would probably say it's a matter of survival and thus these genes are prominently passed on :-)
BUT - some competitive people just take it too far. And another deep-rooted property of humans is hysteric reactions. It seems that Americans have coveted that particular gene in a more prominent manner than the rest of us, because they generally over-react on most things. And then they quickly run over board.
I feel sorry for the small business owners. I think they should just cancel the whole thing for good (only then I expect they will get hate mail from the "cheaters"...)
BTW, I love your new theme and especially the font - makes it SO easy to read for my tired eyes :-)
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