BAPXS no longer feels like my home on the web.
I feel like I'm being attacked (or at least put on the defensive) becuase I'm a non-Christian, non-child friendly single woman who prefers to live with her cat than humans.
As you know I've have kept most of my recent ups and downs off the group completely. I've barely posted to BAPXS except to respond to something written specifically to me.
I just don't feel that that the group and I mesh anymore.
Has the group changed or have I?
I've handed over WW to Kay and as you've seen I haven't bothered with a Monday enabling update for a few weeks. Seriously considering leaving the group as I don't feel I belong anymore.
I'm *not* posting beause I want a flurry of "Mel we love you, Mel please stay". That's not the purpose.
The purpose is to let you know that I am seriously considering leaving. But I do want to ask - has the group changed or have I?
I can't answer that myself - so I would like to hear other people's opinions. Serious answers please .....
229 comments:
1 – 200 of 229 Newer› Newest»{sigh} I'm not sure... I thought I'd been noticing a few things lately, and, quite honestly, I thought it was me more than anything else. I know we had a huge influx of new members at one point, but really, I'm not sure that that's the difference.
As to some recent concerns - I may be totally clueless, but I was slapped right out of the blue by what was said. (Or do I just miss things because I've always been pretty laid back about some of the issues that really set people off? And perhaps more "intellectually" interested in some of the topics rather than emotionally invested?) Dunno... let me think a bit and get my thoughts together a bit more...
The group has suddenly become larger since the SAL group started and personally I feel that that "family" feeling that it had before has been largely diminished. A lot of the new people have done a lot of posting and I suppose if I'm honest, I feel a bit pushed out.
There are people who have very definite strongly held views on particular subjects but
I dont think that some of the postings have been directed especially at you although some of them have certainly been, shall we say, outspoken.
Perhaps before the influx we were used to a reasonably small group who all had similar ideas and were passionate about the same things and now we feel that our nose if out of joint.
Or is it just me?
It seems to me that there's more "noise" and less meaningful talk. And some people have been overly sensitive to (wrongly) perceived attacks on their beliefs. Hang in there Mel and everyone else; in time, the noise-signal ratio settles down and we'll be back to the comfort level we all like. And us mods always have the option of removing troublemakers!
I'm sorry about this Mel - I thought it was just me feeling uncomfortable and overwhelmed which is why I went no mail quite a while back
Mel, I don't know what happened outside the list, you only gave us that one offlist case.
I do feel like you in that the list is losing our family feel... It's just grown too large and there was an influx from people who don't feel the way we do about the list. But I'm with Tina - hang in there. No one will hate you or even dislike you for being a bit more quiet for a while. In the meantime at some point the fact that the list is now closed will come into effect.
I do think that there is kind of a dynamic in mailing lists in that they change at times.
Can you pinpoint what you're missing? I mean, apart from the fact that the influx of new members has changed some of the sound.
Sometimes it feels like you want to grab the closest circle of friends and run away with just them, doesn't it?
I don't know what other advice I can give you, love, you're going through a tough time on the whole at the moment, lots of imminent changes. I don't think it will do any harm if you just take a bit of a time-out on the list :-)
I have felt the difference, too, especially in the last couple of months. Not to name names, but at about the same time as the person who sends the odd cat chart RAKs joined, I just feel a bit like some of my postings are nothing but a waste of time on my part, and that people are trying to make everything tie into the current political climate - can't I have one place where I don't have to be surrounded with politics?? Outside the Orphan Works Bills, politics and needlework shouldn't really cross paths, should they?
There seems to be a bit more anger? frustration? something not as friendly and inviting as it was around the end of the year or so. Personally, I don't think I'd try to initiate the card exchange again this year through the group; it was a wonderful thing last year, but I just see some of the newer folks joining in and it becoming this whole "you didn't do this, you didn't tell me that" thing. If we could just keep the same group as last year, with no communication through the group - but that's kinda mean, too.
I don't know - I can't really put my finger on it; something is different. We're not really having the "discussions" we used to have - they've been crowded out in favor of OT and 473 one-line messages a day that had to be trimmed by the mods, and yet, not one of those people who are constantly being told to trim their posts are even asking "What do you mean?" - at least, not via the group. I think it has suddenly become more work for you mods - and that isn't the goal, is it?
I'm quite convinced that many people don't read their posts to the board so they're not even seeing the *HEAVILY TRIMMED BY MODERATOR*. They certainly aren't asking why they're on mod status
There is certainly more work for the mods to do this year compared to in the past.
But is that a change in the group or the Mods? Are the new members being that much more inconsiderate than existing members or are we mods just slowly becoming more intolerant of such behaviour over time?
I'm definitely finding that certain group members are getting far more het up over things than I'm used to seeing (Meg's post being just the most recent). There is definitely more politics and requests for prayers on the main group than I'm used to seeing.
There's a WHOLE lot more stuff on the OT list - remember when the OT list was primarily for discussing books and movies and TV ???
But then I think - is it the list or is it me? I read sooo many emails that I simply don't care enough to respond to. Is it because we are not a small family anymore that I feel I don't know enough about these people to care?
Or is it a change in me?
That's what I'm struggling with. Personally I think its a little from Column A and a bit from column B. But I wanted to see what you all had to say - because if it is just me, you lot would say so :) :)
I think this is where the mods have been struggling a lot lately too. How do we look after our existing "core" members while still being "fair" to new members.
Do we "have" to be fair to new members? At what stage do we stop being considerate of them, and start expecting them to become more considerate and tolerant of the existing mores in the group?
Perhaps we need to reiterate: NO discussion of religion or politics and all requests for prayers to go to the OT list? I still haven't figured out an effective way to ask people to stop with the one line answers (and there are many who do that). Any ideas on how to get people wth annoying sig lines to change them? Or eliminate the sig lines entirely? I think quite a few of them are just plain stupid.
I can't really comment on the one-liners as that's all I seem to do these days. Anything more in depth we end up discussing over here on Multiply ....
Maybe its time to revisit the "what this list means to us" emails we sent in last year for Claire. Maybe that might help us articulate what is it the list is now missing ...
After work - got to go and look busy now ...
Mel.
This has been pretty interesting to read......I know I've had a bit of the same feelings and to be honest it feels weird to even say that. I say that because I know I'm not one of the members that posts a lot and I don't feel I add a ton to the conversations; but I do love the family feel the group used to give me. I think it comes down to I feel like I can't be myself with so many new people added to the mix. Now it seems like we've lost the feel that people will understand that it's your thinking and you're not trying to change anyone or anything. As always, I could be way off base; but after reading things that's where my own thoughts have gone.
Well, I personally think some of it is because of the current political climate here in the US, and the stress a lot of us are feeling right now - gas is rising astronomically, which is driving up everything else, people are losing jobs left and right, and all you ever hear on the news here is about the stupid election in November - because there is nothing else going on in the world.
I, for one, am more stressed now that I have ever been in my life, from all possible angles, and I am really just plain exhausted from hearing bad news on top of bad news, and just the sheer amount of crap from the 24/7 media blitz - if I could go unplug from everything except my iPod for a couple of weeks, I would feel ever so much better, but since I'm afraid if I take more than 1 day off, I'll come back to find I don't have a job, it isn't going to happen. I think the stresses are showing up in so many places, we might not even be able to see the connection....
And here I was griping above about all the political crap in the list - but maybe other folks are feeling the stresses that I am - and think the list is the forum to vent in. I try not to - that's why I have my other blog, but frankly, I haven't had the energy lately to expend on a political rant. There are a lot of angry, frustrated people in this country right now, and a lot of it hinges on this upcoming "election". If I could just leave the country for the next 5 months, I'd be on a plane tonight.
I'd like to think that most of this will be resolved with the election, but I'm not sure that that's the case - but that's a whole other issue like you said. Who'd have ever thought, though, that the latest Brittney Spears antic would be a welcome respite? I think the media is pretty well out of control here.
But a lot of the issues that you mention have led me to be quieter on the list; I know I've done more chatting on Multiply recently. And I know that I'd been thinking the same thing for me that Kay said. I just wasn't sure enough that this wasn't just me to say anything.
Well, I thought it was just me, but I can definately say that there has been a change in the feeling of BAPXS, which really saddens me. There are very few groups out there that had the same "homey", not flaming feel that this group did. I wonder if this is why some of the older members have stopped posting???
I think when it comes to e-mail, we have to be careful how we read into things, because we can get any feedback from the senders face or the inflection of their voices. I may not agree with someone so I generally chalk it up to being their opinion. And if I don't agree, I don't post about it (you know, the "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all" rule). But I do agree with Karen that politics and religion are very personal and do not belong in the same room with needlework.
As for you leaving the group Mel, I would say that you were being ridiculous, but I thought of leaving the group myself. I sometimes feel like I have a hard time fitting in, but I decided to stick with it and give it another chance.
BTW, I always try to justify my response, so if they've been too brief I do apologize. You can let me know if I'm driving you crazy anytime. I would never want to offend anyone with my posting style, but if I'm being oblivious and need a slap across the head, just feel free to do it. If I were you, I'd just stick it out. On the one hand you're deeling with a ton of issues on a personal front and don't need the aggravation, but on the other hand you may just need the diversion. I would really hate to see you go.
First, I have to say I am honored that you included me in this post. I am certainly not a long time member and Mel, you and the other *core* members are why I choose to stay in this group. I am not a member of tons of groups. Basically 2 large ones, this and ILCS. I have had the opportunity to meet interesting and intellectual people from both groups. But it is this group that I feel the most *family*. I enjoy the long posts, the deep thinking, the a-ha moments I get. You are a large part of that and if you left it wouldn't be the same. When I had some recent family shit to share, who was it that I posted to??? It was mainly people from this group. I feel like I don't have much to contribute, but you all make me think about things differently, if that makes any sense. I recently asked the mods to approve a new member (not knowing the group was now closed) , but now I understand the *shut down*. I don't know how my stitching would be different if not for this group. I am close to finishing my first Chatelaine and I have started my first HAED. Not that THAT is that important, but this is a stitching group, which has turned into an international family to me and if you leave, it won't be the same.
I hardly ever post anymore and I am not sure why. I guess it would be for the same reason as Mel has stated, it 'feels' different now. A lot of the posts, I am just going Wooooaaaa when I read them and thinking that is NOT going to be a good thing. I am also not in a good place right now and seem to be overly sensitive so I am just reading and not posting. Usually the best course of action generally and hasn't really been followed on the group lately. Doesn't feel like a close neat group of friends anymore - sort of reminds me of RCTN some days. I for one am going to stick it out, just because my online friends are my only friends - if I didn't have you guys - I would be a raging alcoholic again for sure. I am sure once all the newbies that joined settle down things will get better - or I hope they will. I miss being able to post whatever I want to vent without being worried about the response.
Chele
You've brought up something I didn't know I was feeling. It used to be that even if I couldn't keep up with the mail, I would try, because there was always something interesting being said. Now I skip most of it and don't care if I'm up to date or not. I agree it is very sad as I need my onliine stitching friends since I don't have any to share stitching with IRL and I would struggle to keep up contact with them if I did. I don't have any answer but I think it is important to start by identifying the problem.
Wow !!!! So it isn't just me ???
OK then - look I'm just thinking out loud here - I haven't thought this out at all - and its a bit left field - so feel free to tell me why it wont/cant/shouldn't work :) :)
and of course we haven't heard from Claire yet who will probably skin me alive for even mentioning my feelings on wanting to leave the group (yet again).
why not makes BAPXS something different. Its already a closed group (albeit that may have originally been seen as a temporary measure).
How about we keep it closed - but allow new members on personal recommendation of existing members. A club more than a public group. And we would not be listed on Yahoo for people to find.
And we would change the rules. Anyone that didn't agree with the rules would of course be free to go elsewhere and chat on any of the other myriad "normal" stitching groups.
* No flaming. No back biting. naturally.
* No posting of religion, politics or life issues - that's what blogs are for. Why not make this group in to a haven *away* from all the ills of the world! Stitching and good news items only. A way to "escape" the nastiness surrounding us.
* Separate out the Inkcircles group - get the BAPXS monikor off its tag and treat it like a normal stitching group non-affiliated with BAPXS.
* No cross posting. Again differentiating this from all the other groups.
* No lurking - get the family feeling back by all participating (one email a month or get chucked)
* Sig line contains blog address only :)
* Any consistent breaking of the rules (eg trimming) gets removed from the group.
I can see that last one becoming less of an issue over time as we whittle down to the core group. And core to me are those who participate. Kay and Nancy have not been with us long, but to me they *are* core to the group !!!!
Another alternative is to shut down BAPXS altogether and start up a new group. Invite *all* current BAPXS members and explain that this is a different type of group and here are the rules. Please be aware that you need to follow the rules to remain part of the group. If you intend on lurking and cross posting then this is *not* the group for you.
I can see this becoming a family-feeling group of around 50 or so people who all chat and be much easier to keep up with.
What do you all think ????
Lunch time is over and I'm off to hide before Claire sees what I'm proposing we do with her group :) :)
Please be aware this is all just off the top of my head right this minute so there are sure to be practical considerations I've completely missed and "rules" or additions I've forgotten to include.
Serious thoughts anyone?
That's such a bad place to be in. Honey if I had money I would send you as much as you needed to get out of your life right now!
Could I just mention that Yourself and Tina are not just moderators...you are group owners...
I have nothing to say other than this is the year that I fully understand why Marjan left.
~~~~~~~~This is going out to the group right now.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A notice to all moderated members.
People who have joined this group and who have not written even one
post to introduce themselves will be removed on June 20th.
Why are you here? We're not a group to lurk in, we're a group that
chats a lot and looks after its treasured members.
People who are on long term moderation [you know who you are and why],
you will also be removed.
BAPXS is a private group owned by people who love it and who don't
want it to change in any way.
Thank you for your time and understanding.
Group Owner and List looker-afterer.
Karen, that's not planned anyway - I've kept my list from last year (minus one person) and I'll write to all of those before I initiate the Christmas card exchange only among these. I'm quite honest in that I wouldn't want some of the people on the list jumping on this.
No, it's not only you. I think the new members are much more *American mainstream* and that runs fairly against our attitudes, Mel. That's the change from the outside.
Maybe you (and some others among us) have changed a bit, too. We're getting older and I find that I *am* less tolerant of some things than I used to be. At the same time I try to let them have their views and just retreat more into my own little space. You're the leo that comes out with it :-)
You certainly don't belong to those who post in a more annoying way, Lori! Keep posting the way you do.
I don't know what it is about one liners... I can tolerate them from some people while from others they do drive me up the wall. Certainly those who *exclusively* contribute with one liners.
You have other input to give and that makes one liners okay. Sometimes you don't have more than a thank you to say and then that's okay with me. It's the stereotype "Looks great / good job" etc that's annoying. Worst is the "Keep up the good work", which is meant to be an encouragement, but to me is more like patronising...
But that's just me. Others may think differently and they are, as you say, entitled to their own opinions.
Mel, I could live with both ways. I have made a good experience with a closed group. There are very quiet times, but then there are just a handful of people and sometimes they have something to say, other times not. But we BAPXSers are more in sync than I'm with those mostly elderly ladies :-)
The other version of inviting BAPXSers into a new, closed list with your stated rules also works. You don't even have to close BAPXS down, just let it run its course, not modding much at all. Claire's mentioning that she feels like Marjan did when she left the group is understandable - and when Marjan left we were about half the members we're now! I would, however, compile a list by all moderators to decide who to invite to the new group.
Well done on the note, Claire! I've seen that at least one member has stepped up. And it's one from whom I can't remember having seen even one post so far.
Three have now written. One whom I have never heard of but was not on moderation and two who are being mod-ed....
The group is not listed in the Yahoo directory, never has been.
So do you want to leave things as they are then?
I know that Tina and I are co-owners - but to me honey it is and always will be YOUR group.
I want to get rid of the moderated people and lose the lot, Jackie included.
I want the sky to be blue so I can garden.
I want everyone to be happy and feel comfy again especially you and everyone here.
I want to sit and ignore the world.
I want my moderators to have MUCH less work like it used to be.
I want everything OT to be on the OT group where it belongs.
I want to be happy and have good health....
If that means deleting the group,well c'est la vie.
Okay, coming into this late. here goes:
I have used the past school year as the excuse of why I did not post or talk. I even found this week, after a long time of being away, that all I wanted to do was just post the link and say, here is my update. I did not want to post an actual explaining post about things. I did that in multiply and that was enough. I also started deleting more than reading when the "talk" started changing. I think that I missed a lot of what has affected you, Mel. However, I can say that I agree wholeheartedly that the entire feeling and sound of the list has changed. I don't know how to fix it, but you know that I will follow you guys wherever you go :)
I would like to be able to come off no mail because for a long while I enjoyed the groups and I would like to enjoy them again.
Oh and I am with you all the way on the health bit
I can just see a number of the moderated people complaining "But I don't understand WHY I'm moderated!" or "I don't know how to trim my posts!"
You know, one of my digests was NOTHING but messages that you guys had to deal with - completely serious, 25 messages that all had to be altered - and who knows how many more in the one before and the one after. I have to tell you, it was all I could do to not post a snotty message to those people, asking them if they were bothering to notice the notes tacked on by the mods and did they have any questions as to what to do to avoid that - but I bit my tongue because 1) not my place, 2) I probably would have come off reallllllyyyy badly, when all I was trying to do was deliver a well-intentioned wake-up call in the heat of the moment, and 3) it would have taken me 2 hours to make it PC - and I'd rather stitch :)
So, I like Claire's message - short, sweet, to the point - which might just go over some heads, but maybe they will figure it out when they are removed. Nah, probably not. And the "mystery" posters that are starting to come out of the woodwork - well, nice try, but I'm pretty sure that falls under the "Too little, too late" rule :) And I like the change to the BoInk SAL group, though it took some creative refreshing and re-logging in to get all the 1s and 0s to realign :) FYI - that's a digest that I pretty much skim, since I don't know any of the posters in there except us and Tasha from Oregon. So, whatever you guys want/need to do, I'm behind you - just point me in the right direction, I'll catch up :)
Question - do people really belong to 100 groups or better???? Wow, I just can't imagine being tied to that much stuff.... Maybe I just don't have the proper OCDs?
I'm a few days behind on my group mails, so I guess I've missed the defensive feeling you're getting. I'll go home and get caught up tonight...
I will say that this has happened on almost every large group I've been a member of in the past. It never fails that over time, older members leave, and new people join who don't quite "mesh" with the regulars. Of course, the new folk never see it that way - they always just think we're a snobby clique - and trouble ensues...
I like the idea of a new group, but I don't necessarily think BAPXS needs to be shut down. There are still lots of great people there, and some good sharing going on. Perhaps just a private group like Mel suggested for us, and keep BAPXS open for a while to see how it goes without many of us posting as much and take it from there? If it flounders, or if it flames out of control, just shut down all the subgroups and hand off ownership of the main group to someone who wants it, and let it be their problem! ;-)
Welcome to America, if you aren't high-up in banking or insurance or employed by a drug manufacturer, nothing is certain these days. Bad times, to come to a head between now and November, and then the fallout....
Edited to add that that's my political statement, and there's no more of that from me....
That's just it - some of them probably post one liners to at least half of these lists.
I'm sure that some listies just join every list they can because they are afraid to miss anything and then end up being totally overwhelmed. Makes participation very difficult.
Personally I've practically left all other stitching groups or I'm no mail (sad thing, really). But I've made friends on BAPXS and I'm happy that most of the friends I originally made on CCS are on BAPXS, too.
OCD = ??
Thanks for your remark about the comments in the messages, *I* didn't have any form of feedback on them at all. Certainly no one who asked what this meant. We have concluded that none of them ever read their own messages...
My DH is employed by a large pharma but his job is anything but secure these days (thanks to the Vytorin fiasco and the subsequent plunge in stock price. Whose brilliant idea was it to try and HIDE the results??)
Mariann, OCD =Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. You must have OCD if you're in 100+ yahoo groups!
Yeah, that is a bad situation. Maybe it's just the drug company's advertising firms that are on solid footing these days? LOL
Thanks, Tina :-) I would agree. See my naiveté that I don't even know what the abbreviation means, LOL.
I'm sorry to hear that your husband's job isn't safe! It must be horrid to know that they might cut jobs and not really know. The worst in such a situation is that one feels like hanging in the air and nothing is there you can grab and no real net beneath you either. I know how it feels!!!
He has survived several rounds of cuts since his company merged with Schering-Plough but the latest round of cuts is reaching up pretty high into the management levels. I don't understand why it hasn't yet hit the CEO's office! Or why the CEO hasn't yet volunteered to give up his multimillion dollar bonus for engineering a disaster!
Mel - I'm a bit late in joining this topic since we've been travelling, but I really have to agree with you. I've noticed that since we have sooo many new members it just isn't home anymore. There is actually one person (no I'm not going to tell who) that I've thought about leaving just because of their constent posts about needing ideas for her designs. I'm all for helping a friend out, but I feel like BAPCS wasn't created to feed your business ideas. JMHO
I've been very quiet because life here hasn't been so great (just ask Claire) and I didn't want to bring the group down, but I am in complete agreement that the modd has changed.
The group has changed, it doesn't have the warm feel it had prior to this year. I don't know what it is, necessarily that changed it, but I'd have to say it was really noticable after a bunch of new people joined the group. And yes, I'll admit, I may have gotten sidetracked a few times along the way and may have been too vocal on some topics on the main group, I never intended to upset anyone. Sometimes I just don't know when to keep my mouth shut or fingers off the keyboard...
When I first discovered the Groups on Yahoo, I joined several. I couldn't keep up, and started weeding out the ones that just didn't feel "right" to me. BAPXS was the one where I felt the most comfortable and felt like I had the most in common with people. I have felt like leaving the group recently too, but decided perhaps I was being overly-sensitive, and took a long hard look at myself. Things constantly change, our viewpoints shift and change in relation to the things going on around us, and depending on our mood at the time something happens or is said, can influence our lives long after... sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. So I decided I'm going to stay because I like to see what everyone is working on, what they've found for new stash and to share knowledge. I know I'm not the first to say this, but without the friends I've made on this group, I wouldn't have a lot of friends.
I've been reading around trying to get some stuff done here at work (actually work related, no less! gasp)
You've all summarized a lot of what I've been thinking, and I've been trying to find out
I'm mostly glad to know that I'm not completely out of synch with the rest of the universe. All I really knew for sure was that it didn't feel like I was wandering into Claire's lounge and just relaxing anymore. And I don't rush to read my email - I pretty much skim through. That's not how I've ever felt about the group, but I thought it might have just been the space I'm in at the moment.
And as for the whole group thing - I'll support whatever the owners and mods choose... I just haven't dropped out because I'm afraid it would be way too easy to lose touch with people who have become VERY important to me!
That's the *only* reason I haven't quit. Also I did wonder like everyone else here it seems - whether it was BAPXS or whether it was me.
Like others here I've just been skimming posts and replying to the occasional piece of silliness - I remember a couple of years back Claire commenting because I'd posted 17 messages in one day - and that was back when I was checking before and after work daily.
I also *know* I'm battling depression right now. I can feel it within me. I can feel it in my reactions and behaviours.
One of the things that depressed people generally do is withdraw. I was am still confused whether a lot of this is changes to BAPXS itself or whether I was simply finding excuses to withdraw away from my main support network. Because that's what you guys are - you are my main support mechanism! Other that you guys I have mum and Alison. And I wouldn't do that to them :)
But the more I read and absorb what you lot say, the more I realise that it is BAPXS, not the depression. The list is not what it once was. I got quite excited while typing my proposal for a new list yesterday :) :) :)
Claire's email overnight has prompted something that I think has added to the "non honey" feeling.
see if you can follow this pattern - or if I'm jumping to conclusions.
Part of the non-homey feel is that we were (and from some members still are) getting a lot of boilerplate cross posts. Most of the time its unrelated to BAPXS and is often just copied whole from their blog anyway.
But the thing that has me riled up right now - and I know I'm riled up, that's why I want to discuss it here - to get feedback about how objective or not this is - and I'm rambling ....
A lot of people have piped up overnight saying variations of "I don't post because my life has lots of "issues" but I love reading your posts and being enabled."
Is it just me or have we gone from being an inclusive discussion to simply a floor show for an audience ....
HOLY CRAP is that the time - I'm gonna be late !!!!! I gotta leave in one minute and I'm still in my pyjamas!
I think once the weeding has taken place, things may get back to a comfortable level. I hope so. Or I'll be spending a lot more time stitching (as I should anyway since I got a NEW MODEL from Tracy yesterday!)
Well, that's an interesting thought. There is one girl that I e-mail back and forth to every so often, who I met through one of the groups, no idea which one now, who left the group because 1) she was there to LEARN stuff and wasn't, and 2) because it had turned into a "Show us your Stash! kind of thing. This is a cut & paste of my reply to her, in regards to BAPXS & TheSamplerLife:
"I guess I never really went into the groups with an aim to learn anything; I just wanted to talk to somebody else that shares this hobby with me, since I do not know a single stitcher in person. In fact, I don't really know anybody who does any crafting, not anymore. I suppose I've probably picked up a lot of stuff since joining these couple of groups; hmm, never really thought about it much. I do know I've picked up a lot of friends, which was more my goal :) Now, if there were a local guild that I would consider joining, that would be more along an educational approach for me, and is something I've looked into. That's for when the kids are bigger, and my weekends and evenings belong more to me, I guess."
So to answer your question, I think different people join the groups with different intentions and that makes sense. Maybe some of it is pure voyeurism - if looking at other people's needlework and stash can count towards that (I personally think so). This person I chat with was looking for specific skill discussion and technique, like in a classroom atmosphere, if I read her correctly - which, if you take all of the "This is what I do" posts in replying to a question, that's what we are doing, albeit informally. I guess there will probably always be the wallflowers and those on the fringe, just following along as the rest of us do our thing. And the day could come when I have nothing to post, but still want to "keep up" with everyone, so I see the ideas behind those pleas posted today. But, too, for those offended or ticked off by Claire posting that, well, maybe they are part of the problem - considering it's Claire's list (with you others, of course), she can axe whomever she wishes, and who's to say otherwise? And then the ones who do not respond still, well, I guess they miss out. Obviously, if they have been a part of the group before, but aren't horribly active right now, they probably aren't the problem area. It's just whether you owners feel confident enough to know who makes the cut - and then preparing for the barrage of e-mails you might get afterwards, if they retained your personal addy.
And I hope you weren't late!!!
Maybe an idea is to see how the list goes with the weeding and keep the idea of a private list for the original core as a back up plan. If the list goes back to normal, great, and if it doesn't we can start another list for the family feeling we've lost on the main list.
I do understand lurking as there are lists I do that on, where I'm interested in the talk but don't really have anything to say (I try to stick to the "if you don't have anything worthwhile to say, don't say anything at all" idea) so I personally think it is okay to post only occasionally, but that's just me.
It's the people who post all the time and have nothing worthwhile to say that drive me nuts as I have to weed through their nothing to find the posts of people who do have something to say.
But the bottom line for me is that BAPXS isn't fun anymore and it used to be great fun.
This is surely the core of the problem.
Hopefully the solution will be a weeding out of members although I see that there were still a couple people with their hackles up.
I personally dont see the lurkers as much of a problem. Its the ones who take offense at anything you say that they dont like and the ones who post as though they were the owners of the group who upset me and make me feel uncomfortable.
I truly hope that Tina is right and that things get back to the way they were. Only time will tell. But like her, I've got a model coming in the post so I can always stitch and continue to skim messages in the meantime.
I think it would be a good idea to start a smaller, by invite only group, in addition to weeding the main group. I was surprised by some of the posts on the main group today, mainly because I felt like I was interacting with a whole pile of strangers. Who would have thought that you could experience the "new to the group" feeling with one I've been a member in for 3 years? It's like a ghost town over there without everyone piping in.
I guess the most important thing to learn from this is why things went sour to begin with so it doesn't happen again.
I understand lurking, but if they haven't responded in a month (or some other reasonable amount of time), then I think it's time to part ways. I do not like the thought of being entertainment for somebody else, and in a way, Mel is right about this. If I'm good enough to enable, I'm good enough to know the how and the why so I can at least do it again!
I really don't want to lose my good stitching friends. I know zero people who stitch, other than my online friends, and for me that fills a void that would otherwise go neglected. Because of my illness, I don't get out that much and it's nice to be able to connect with you guys on a daily basis. Else I'd get pretty lonely.
Even in its altered state, BAPXS is a better place than another list I'm on where all people do lately is talk about their illnesses!
And Tina has one other point that I've been thinking... I've gotten to the point that I read BAPXS (more or less) and one Yuku board; because they're better places than a lot of the other lists I've belonged to over the time I've been online. (And that's where the people who have become important to me are.) What I appreciate (second) most about both of these places is how well managed they are, and how fair the mods are in both. I know how much work and headache is involved; J has been a moderator and owner for two different radio boards, and I honestly don't completely understand why y'all keep doing it! (But I thank you for keeping things as well as you have.)
Nope got here on time and munching breakfast as I read through these posts.
Mariann, is this what you were trying to say with your "mainstream American" comment?
No offense to the Americans here, but this is what I see that comment as meaning - and yes it upsets me too !!!
I do try not to diss anyone else's lifestyle choices (and yes I do count marriage children and religion as lifestyle choices) or if I do I do it gently with humour. So much of that has been taken the wrong way lately that I'm not game to comment at all on certain topics.
Geez, I go on call for one 30 hour shift and look what happens!!!
I too feel like things are different. There are simply too many posts for me to keep up with. When I first joined, things were reasonable and though I would have to delete a few posts, I could generally keep up. Now....not a chance. And post after post after post after post from one certain member bore me out of my mind!
BAPXS used to be my escape but now it just makes me tired. I don't post much because I dont have time to read much and don't feel like I can always just jump in because I don't know what I miss. I find that I search for posts that are written by certain people to keep in touch with the core group. Those are my family (and how dare another Stephanie join the group....hmmph....sometimes I feel like she is confused with me....and well even though I don't mind you all calling me Dr. Steph, I don't like signing that way....and well I'm just not Stephanie in Ky or Steph. My signature is Stephanie and so is hers and well I WAS HERE FIRST) OK off my rant.
So anyway, Mel, Jodie, Lori, Mariann, Claire, Paula, Kay, Sisu....you among a few others who in my current sleep deprived state I'm not thinking of keep me sane when I've had a bad day. You read my multiply site when my heart is broken (but I try to keep it off the list). You celebrate with me as I plod through each rotation. You cheer me on when I manage to pick up my stitching. This is the longest period of time I have ever stitched without months going on between stitches.
I want the old list back....and though there are sometimes new members that really add to the group, they are few and far between. Usually the new members putter out over time but they seem to be a hearty group right now. I want to be able to come home in the evening and actually read all the posts.....without falling asleep. I want to be able to post enough meaningful messages that if I post with an update that has 5 or 10 stitches added that I will still get encouragement and not feel like an intruder that only posts updates.
Well that's probably not the most lucid post but I think it gets the point across (btw, I'm only an intern for 1 more week!)
WOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOO Stephanie !!!!!!!
You are indeed *our* Stephanie and always will be !!!!
Thank you for takign the time to wade through all of this and then actually post a comment - I can only *imagine* how tired you are!
Will raise a glass to you next Wednesday to celebrate your release from internship hell !!!!!
Actually I just got up from a 6 hour power nap.....feeling pretty good....will be back in bed within the next 2 hours though.
WOW - I know it's very different for you - but it seems to me like a couple of weeks ago that you began your internship, Stephanie! :) Congrats!!
Yes, Stephanie really hit the nail on the head! When I read that, I just let out a huge sigh. That is exactly how I have felt this past year! And I agree with Marianne about the "American mainstream" issue. Of course, I am American, but I think it goes along with a shallow, disposable feeling from many of the posters. They want to get feedback for a business, they want prayers, good comments about their progress. They don't want to laugh, enjoy stitching, and enjoy our differences that made us a family. And I don't want to feel like I have to share what is going on with my health, hubby etc., unless I share it on my blog. But lately I feel shut out too. And I was hurt that some of the posters just jump on the band wagon today. The list isn't important enough until you are threatened with removal? Maybe this is my bad day talking (lost my cell phone and have to cough up $200 to replace) but it is really irritating.
I also hope things get better with the weeding, but I am not sure this will get rid of the problems.
I couldn't include Kay's part of your post, but yes, that's basically spelled out what I feel. And like you (and because I simply forgot) I do want to point out that I don't relate all Americans on the list as that kind of mainstream :-)))
One thing I've always liked in the group was that it was so diverse! It has lost that a little, but to keep posts reasonable (and not fall into hysterics all the time) we have had to cut a little on the diversity. At least that's how I feel.
Before I say anything else though I'm going to read all that's been posted over night (and it looks like there's been a LOT since I left work yesterday. I wasn't online in the evening :-) ) and then comment.
Just one thing - this here is a PM thing, so don't be afraid to name names. We mods need to know them to talk to the offending people (or throw them out, blech)...
I know it's harsh - but if we want the family and lounge feeling (we could also call it a never-ending stitching party, since we're spread all over the globe!) back we have to give the problems names.
I think every here just assumed that was the case :) :)
Mariann is correct - this *Is* my blog and its a PM so you can see all the people who know about the conversation - so yes out with it.
Name names who pisses you off ???? And don't worry about upsetting us - there are four main BAPXS mods and we don't always agree and we are all here so feel free even if you think you are going to upset someone :)
I think that's the thing...we badly need names from people who are not the mods...we need to know who pisses you off. Please do tell us or we may invit them to a new group unknowingly. I would think it unlikely but...you never know LOL.
So, a new group...The Lounge or The Anti-BAPXS.....
Yippee!! huge celebrations due any time now then :-), do you know where you will be based as a fully fledged member of the medical profession? and does this mean more or less stitching time?!!
I vote for:
Claire's Loungeroom
or
Sanctuary
I vote for the lounge - and I'm sorry I can't remember the name of the person that was grinding me under :-( but if there is a new group can I have an invite and I promise to be a good Dragon and keep posting! (well except for holidays and after the major stress Mark and I are going through)
So you mean I would have to start another group and be responsible when the next one goes pearshaped? really?
PMSL
Oooh Sanctuary! Now that IS a good idea Gothy
Is this theme a bit easier to read?
Well I've always thought of BAPXS as your loungeroom :)
Then we'll call it The Sanctuary Loungeroom
I'll go create and then..hey presto, come back right here with a button
Will be a few mins as buying some diabetic stuff online right nbow and want to finish that first.
Yep -thanks Gothy!
Isn't Santuary Loungeroom just a tad long-winded ???
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SanctuaryLoungeroom
Call it the SLR for short....oh look that brings in another of my hobbies...
The Sanctuary Lounge maybe then?
Click to join SanctuaryLoungeroom
If you don't like the name, I can change it....I just liked how it sounded like a comfy coffee bar...read the description at the page before you decide.
Ooh, we've gone grey, I like it...so readable, phew
Even I was getting pissed off at the back on green ... :) :)
OK - who else are we going to let in?
And I'd like to include Paula DB's list of rules:
Okay I am going to put in my two cents worth.
1. The rule is, that if you don't post ever, not even a introductory email you are gone.? Live with it.
2. Everyone can at least post one email every two weeks. It doesn't have to be a manuscript. Just a note saying what you are working on, if for some reason life is so busy that you can't find time to stitch , everyone has those times, then say so.
3. With gas prices soaring, economy woes, this group should be somewhere where we can get away from our problems, worries and enjoy reading what other people are working on, view their finished projects, or get excited about their new project they just started.
4. The group leader should not release the reins to someone else. She is doing a great job, if she wants help, there are those that surely will step up and say "I'll help". No one can please everyone, a person shoudn't have to even try. Those negativity people should just take a hike, we don't need you. Life is too short.
5. Let us get back to being a great group and enjoy cross stitching for that is what brought us together in this group.
Click to join SanctuaryLounge
Damn, changed it.
Ok, I don't think we need rules. This is a very personal group to all of us here and the people we let in are only those we love so they should never need rules....
It is not listed in Yahoo groups so nobody should ever find it by accident and for me, I think the only rule is to never EVER mention it on another group.
The first rule of the SL is do not talk about the SL
The moment Paula said Claire's Lounge I thought that The Lounge should be the name for the new list as well :-))))
*giggle*
Now see, that's the kind of thing that's been missing lately.
Colleen should be in as well. Colleen isn't on the Multiply sites, but she's a great poster and she's loads of fun. I don't remember many posts from her that haven't either made me smile or laugh...
Not to mention the SL at all is absolutely good. People who are let in should be reminded of that.
Wooo hooo !!!! no rules !!!!
We are friends - friends do not have rules !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
And i"m in - even if you did cvhange the name part way through my first attempt at joining :)
You're not just in....you're co-owner...apparently your part of the lounge has the lights on whereas mine doesn't...it definitely needs it's own management as it appears to have a mind of its own!
But that's my humour...is that what's been missing? have I been grouchy ALL the time?
I think a few of us have been grouchy on the BAPXS list ....
yeah, guess so.
I wouldn't say grouchy, because to me that implies a fault on your side and I don't see it that way. Just that the spirit hasn't been there that encourages quirky humour.
Okay, I need to lie down and get some sleep as Marcus is home all day tomorrow. I look foward to finding lots of mail on my new list in the morning.
Sleep well love...
*snerk* I think this is going to be great (and from the posts so far I think I could be right!), this could be one group I leave up and running when I go away - just so I can keep on track of everything when I get back!
Is there really another Stephanie on BAPXS? really? I had never noticed. I see the name Stephanie and it's you I think of...always.
Yes, Stephanie Powell or something...
LoungeMother, is this a BYO place?
Yes, there is another Stephanie...
Yes, the theme is more readable....
And yes, I'm off to click on Claire's button!
More after coffee when the thought processes kick in....
Amazing! I go to drop off my DS at computer camp, get back and we have sanctuary!! LOVE IT :)
Lounge mother?? I sound like a lizard PMSL.
Yes, mariann is already on the wine, and I could easily be talked into a Pimms or three.
Kidlets..I'm going offline for a couple of hours and Mel is asleep but Voldy is around and will be able to approve any of you to join the lounge:)
[I don't think she's quite realised yet that she is also an owner of the lounge.]
See what happens when I go to sleep and then go to work and try to do some work?? A whole Sanctuary was created in that time! Off to go click a button :)
Enjoy your break Claire! Your hard work today is much appreciated!
I have realized in the last 10 minutes that Claire has made me a bouncer!
Ohhhh, you get to be big, mean and tough! Any tatoos?
I wouldn't say grouchy really. But there have been a couple of responses from both Claire and Gothy that had me cheering that they let their inner 'bitch' out!! I was sitting here cheering at the response and my husband just keeps saying if you let 500 women be in a group together there will be trouble eventually. I tell him to shut up.
Very good rule! :) shhhhhhhhh, don't tell....I feel like a kid and have a secret club house. LOVE THAT. lol Adults only, no kids right....please tell me I can leave the kids at home. lol
Just clicked to join SL. I was going to mention that there is the other group is sitting there almost unused except for Jackie until Claire mentioned Jackie in one of her posts. Poor Mega is sitting there with just 3 or 4 people posting cus we are all over here.
Okay - I clicked to join too :-)
Ok , just reading this one, off to see what the *new* group is up to!
I just got home and WOW! I have not caught up on the main list yet. Mel's blog was closer to the top of my e-mail list. So, I shall add my 2 cents.
I am guilty of a recent very religious post. I don't know how it was construed by everyone, but in actuality it was an effort to keep Meg from leaving the group. I was trying to let her (and in a way everyone) know that we need to not be so touchy on the beliefs of others and just love each other for who we are. And by 'we' I meant our tried and true core members.
Now on to specifics:
1. Mel. I love you more than you know. You remind me much of the me I was 10 years ago, and I miss that me. So I really don't want to lose you. Even if you left BAPXS, I would be stalking your blog. I know I have both kids and religion, and you don't, but I certainly hope that would not drive you away. You know I don't think you really need either unless you feel your lacking to begin with. Life is and can be rich and meaningful without either.
2. Mariann. I want you to know that your non-religious beliefs did not offend me at all, I was just trying to help Meg. You are an intelligent, capable, and level headed friend, and I certainly feel much closer to you than to Meg. I don't want you to leave either.
3. Tina. Of all my online contacts, I have known you the longest, and I have a deep respect for your intellect. You and I have not always agreed and have had our off-list debates, but I know that we both can do so without taking it personally, and that is a nice kind of friend to have.
4. Stephanie, I don't know why, but I feel as proud of you as if you were my own little sister. I don't have a little sister, but I can imagine. LOL. You will always be the only Stephanie on BAPXS to me.
5. Claire. Ever patient Claire. How do you put up with all of 'us' and all of 'them' and not fly off the handle? I respect your ability to get across the 'I am getting pissed' vibe enough to wake them all up without throwing your hands in the air and dropping the whole thing. Please don't give up on the 'us' that BAPXS used to be. I think it can be saved. I hope at least.
As for the rest of you, I don't see any faces here that I have major issues with. Those are back in that other world. If they can be trimmed out, good, if not, I will adapt. But if there is a new BAPXS group formed, please, please, PLEASE only invite me if you want me there. I don't want to be one of the pests. Knock me upside the head if I am doing something that bugs you and don't just assume I know better. I can be pretty daft sometimes.
now I am off to clock the SL link. If we really are going to name names, I think I have a few to add.
Unfortunately, I have 2 more years of training still....but I'm not the bottom of the food chain anymore. And still no stitching time....have to study for my lisencse to practice medicine and then have to study for pediatric boards.
Sisu - I've tried to respond to you privately but darn it your email keeps bouncing! I had no problems with your recent email because you were stating your opinion. There was a number of off list conversations between Meg and the Mods because she was "offended" by anything that didn't match her opinion. You see the difference?
As to the rest of your email, yes you know who would love some fluffy socks and her address is in the BAPXSRAK database .....
You know I woke up this morning and my first emotion was excitement! What's happening with the SL list - have the Americans woken up and joined in ???
I had to force myself to shower and dress and get brekky ready before I sat down at the computer because I knew if I didn't I would run out of time and still not have them done.
I've been this interested to see reactions to things on my blog - but I have *not* been this excited about pstrs to am email list in such a very very long time!
I did wake up and join. It's been very exciting to read, I've started at the beginning and will send out a message shortly. Thanks for allowing me to join in the fun!! :)
Oh poot! I thought this meant your time was your own again and you would be raking the cash in (whilst looking after the kidlets), and getting loads of stitching time
Sisu, you hit on what I've always loved so much about our core group. We're all very different in some areas, yet we've always been able to talk (and even debate, as you've said!) about our own opinions, thoughts and feelings without really hurting each other. I've learned a LOT about so many different things from everyone, and never felt that I was judged because I didn't agree with someone.
oh puhleeze, you know we love you to pieces.
Was trying to work out who else to invite...I would like to Invite Kimberly Fawn as she is such a good friend of mind and a real sweetie.
Was thinking of Rosanne...beyond that, I don't think there's anyone else I would want in my life full time....
Anyone else want people invited?
You are a sweetie. I do fly off the handle, very much so but in the privacy of my own home or in email to Tina and Mel....
I'd like to think BAPXS can be saved. I like that a lot of rats have deserted today, suits me just fine PMSL...I'm loving the impassioned pleas for me to stay...very sweet.
But, I love the idea of a small private group and am very happy that Mel woke up excited. If my starting another group is all it takes for her to be happy, hell I'll start one every day.
Invite Needlemania Marc, the other Mark, Hans....he's quiet but love it when he posts.
As I said - I think Colleen is fine
Oh and Ellen is HIGH HIGH on my list of people that annoy the hell out of me.
I have invited Colleen already.
I do have a problem with inviting Marc though. He's left and rejoined BAPXS so many times. I don;t think he likes me. Every so often, there will be a little flare up, I'll respond and he'll unsub.
No problem then....all should be in agreement.....go approve me
Sisu, we wouldn't want to miss you either. I didn't bother to take offence :-) Thanks for your nice words, I won't leave and I'll love to see you on the new list :-) We need your wit and humour!
I'll second that one! She's one that I usually don't read.
Don't want to be to forward and step on toes; but I would like my friend Jennie to be invited. If not; I'm fine with that too. Just thought I would throw her name into the mix.
jennie....remind us of her details....I'll send some invites out tomorrow.
She's from AL, her Email is jesouthern@yahoo.com. We've been friends for roughly 10 years....wow, has it been that long? YIKES!! Oh, here is her Multiply site... http://jenniestuart.multiply.com/
Ok I am still in needle shock from the Dr. office but what about Beth, Tere, and the other Shell? I know they hardly ever post but they used to be like family over on Mega. Can't think of anyone else right off the top of my head. I would say Kat but she is so busy right now she isn't really stitching. Not sure if any of these people ever raised any red flags with the mods that I am unaware of so it is all up to you guys.
Sorry Shawn - Jennie Stuart annoys the crap out of me - but I'm willing to be persuaded otherwise as we go down the track ?
I came to work this morning with such a jaunt in my step that inquiries have been made as to whether I have acquired another "night time companion".
Now that is getting ridiculous :) :) Needless to say I just grinned and didn't say a word :) :) :)
As far as I'm concerned we gathered a lot of my companions back together and back to being themselves ....
I won't invite Tere for personal reasons. She's not up to it right now.
ShellFL, sure...and Beth could use a big hug or three too...
Would love to ask Kat but she has such a busy life, it's insane.
Chele, how you doing now? eaten??
Good grief you lot - in the last three hours. THREE HOURS. I have received nearly 200 messages in my email inbox !!!!
It sounds the list needed the shakeup and the new one to be created!
Hi Hon,
Yep I have eaten! Feel much better now and not dizzy anymore. Who knew even when drinking 5 bottles of water in so many hours you can still feel dizzy! I got my prescriptions for my 3 meds, had the Pap test done, the lab work done, had breast exam done and for a new one I also got a Tetnes shot (spell check won't help me) since I couldn't remember when my last one was. Next Wednesday is Mammogram day. Fun fun but at least I can eat!
Hope Tere's surgery (?) I think went well. I haven't been on Spark People in forever either so if she is posting there - oops. Beth hasn't even been posting to her blog because I get an announcement when she does. It took her almost 2 months to respond to my Happy Birthday. Kat I know is swamped - poor lady!
And yes oh man are we shook up, I haven't been off this computer all day between BAPXS which I deleted all of and started over, SL and here. I just go from one to the other and back again. YEA!
Fun isn;t it :)
Chele, I'll reply about Tere and Beth in a PM.
Water has no sugar or protein in it so you will still feel dizzy:(
Can I also suggest that we hold off on Marc? He's snapped at me several times (publicly) on another group without any visible provocation. I won't say that there wasn't a point to what he said, but it was something that would have been handled much better had he taken it to off list email.
Oh yeah, and I'm trying to wade through all of the emails that suddenly flooded in to get to the lounge - I came back here for a break! :)
I'll third & fourth the No Ellen - especially as 80% of the last 3 digests I skimmed were her - glad she woke up. Not. GRRRRRR....
And as to Marc, well, he's not the soul of discretion, by any means. Even though it's an oft-repeated rule on his group, TSL, he is ALWAYS copying conversations from elsewhere and pitching a hissy, which, of course, whips up all of the hysterical types - and out of 1100 members, that means a LOT.
The number of times he's quoted BAPXS on TSL..it's just not on in my book..what goes on in one group should stay in that group and not be used elsewhere unless with permission from the original email writer.
Can we please stick to ladies only?
That's perfectly fine Mel.
PMSL! She is the one and only person that thought she had to contact me offlist to ATTACK me for my post the other day. Glad to know I am not the only one that doesn't like her. Thanks for the chuckle Stephanie!
What the (insert expletive of choice!), hmm can't remember now but someone decided that since I was a pagan it was her mission in life to make sure I burnt in hell (well her form of hell at any rate), I just remember I put her on block very quickly indeed!
what about Tim?
I'll 5th that motion! Her posts irk me. Who does she think she is attacking you??? You should have spoke up about that. You weren't out of line in the least!
On the other hand, on another list that I'm on, a very sweet 82 year old women contacted me offlist to tell me that she had the runs and wanted to know what I thought of it!
I agree with you Claire. IMHO, I've never seen a male start a discussion or really move it forward. Pretty much just post a progress picture and move on. Just my observation...
I'm so glad I missed a bunch of this drama... part of what annoys the snot out of me about so many "Christians" (no offense meant) is that they feel the need to do exactly what y'all have said and attack (or worse - try to convert!) people who don't subscribe to their exact subset of beliefs. Sheesh! I admit to a pretty... ummm... eclectic belief system of my own; it works for me, I haven't turned into an axe murderer (yet!) and I've had some experiences that have shown me that there is definitely something above and beyond us humans. They're other stories for other days, though.
That sounds like a fascinating blog topic all on its own - I know mum can add some stories in there too!
Ohh yeah - any objections to mum (denise) joining in SL? She's quiet mostly but she enjoys the company ...
Your mum is OK with me.
Can I suggest Anita B be added too? She has been a pretty regular poster for a while now but I admit I really don't know much about her.
I don't mind to stick to ladies only... Though I would have suggested Tim, he's such a sweetie he'd not stick out.
And if I may suggest one more, I'd suggest Anita Berryhill. She's always sweet, level-headed and friendly on BAPXS. Very open, too.
I have to admit that I'm glad, Mel spoke up about Jennie. She may be nice, but I'm still smarting a bit about all the cross posts about anything. AND I agree with the no to Marc.
I know that Ellen annoys a few people. I think she's rather annoying at times, but I believe she really doesn't mean to annoy. I'm sorry she attacked you for your post, Sisu!
My opinion of her is that she's really, really scatterbrained. In any case, I wouldn't have suggested to invite her either, even though I like her in her scatterbrained way just as I like Gail with all her plugging for her designs and her sig line (which really peeves me)! We can't change people so we have to either take them as they are or avoid them.
Just funny - I haven't read all the posts when I suggested Tim (even though he IS a male) and Anita B. I'm glad Mel and Sisu spoke up for the two of them before I did.
Tim and his wife are either about to have their second kid or have just had "it"...I think he'll be a little too busy with real life for another group.
Happy to invite Denise of course and Anita B.
Just spoke with Denise on the phone - she's been rather ill over the past couple of days and I doubt she will be online for another few days. Really bad gastro bug .....
Oh yuck...send her my love and get well wishes.
I have sent her and Anita an invite....don't forget, you too can invite people:)
Oh I'm having too much fun being a participant right now .... and Bones is about to come on ....
So I get to do ALL the work...you go enjoy Bones, it'll all be there when you get back...all fics have been uploaded and I'm outta here for a while...
Thanks sweetheart - just caught up on BAPXS - oooh that place annoys me in comparison to our new home :(
Heading to bed as soon as Bones is finished and will catch you all on the flipside again ....
Member suggestions for SL:
Gina
Elizabeth (Frizzy Lizzie)
Kimberley
trish
tim
Anonylistmum
Anonyminion
And now I'm taking these two Cabana boys and following Trubs off to bed.;
Feel free to turn down any suggested names
two Cabana boys? Aren't you the greedy one, LOL!
Greedy is taking two men and a woman - but I actually do want some sleep .....
Off now - hugs all - catch you in 6 hours or so ....
Sleep well, sweetie!
Hope Denise starts feeling better soon!!!!
Gina has no online time any more which is why I haven't asked her.
Lizzie...when did you last see her online?
Kimberley is already invited.
Trish, fine by me.
Tim, I would prefer not. Too buddy buddy with Marc for my liking and I want what's in this group to stay in this group.
Hmmm, there's been so much chatter at BAPXS the last week or so, I'm really having to think about who's who.....
You can definitely add me to the "no Ellen" camp, and I'm not a big fan of Tobie or Gail, either. I do like Frishawn, but I know she's been one of the non-trimmers, so whatever the mods decide is fine with me.
For invites, how about Anne Egelston, Analisa, and Lisa (UnicornWiz)? They are all on the quieter side, but always pleasant, and seem to follow the rules.
Please don't hesitate to tell me if this is none of my business, but may I ask what happened to Tracy Harris? One day, she and I were trading emails in the group about something, and then she emailed me offlist and told me she'd been asked to leave the group. I didn't go any farther than that with her - two sides to every story and all - but I was just curious since I didn't see any problem with her on the group.
Tracy was particularly unpleasant to the mods. She outright went and told us she wasn't interested in following any of the links or looking at people's work. Her attitude towards BAPXS sucked in private emails.
She left.
I hope Anita B will join, I agree she is very nice. She has emailed me privately in the past about my daughters problems and was a wonderful help!!
Do we want to send invites out to people who are listed on this PM but for one reason or another haven't yet checked in ....
Laura
Tracy
Lyne
Kay
Natalie
Teegs
Debbie?
Lizzie seems to have disappeared again. I know she works as a medical secretary (or whatever you call them overe there) as well as designing; that they have had financial problems and is/was suffering from depression. I've been trying to contact her for a couple of weeks. She wants a model stitched (big un) by Sept but I haven't had it yet.
Pro'ly wouldn't hurt. What has Teegs been up to, anyway? I know she got that shift change, and that's about the last I heard. I assume Claire's keeping up with her???
Lyne is away.
Tracy is busy as always.
Kay and Natalie are both here.
Laura's online right now, she'll find it.
Debbie...send her an invite !
Who knows if Donna will ever get online again. Me keep up with her...barely...
Ditto - but that's why I thought this might be a good group for her ....
She's not been online or returning txts at all lately it seems. Too busy in Real Life ....
Kay & Mel - about doing models for Ms. Lizzy.... She had contacted me months ago about stitching the conversion she was going to do of one of the Queen Elizabeth portraits, even giving me a good long 2 years to get it done since it was a huge piece. And then... nothing. Then she redid her website, and it wasn't even mentioned in her Drawing Board area anymore. Do either of you know if she just gave up on the bigger projects to concentrate on other things? I know the QEI was sounding like a very ambitious project - she was going to include pearls and some specialty stitching to mimic the ruff. And I just didn't pester her after I told her that I would do it - I figured the next contact was her to me, telling me it was ready to be sent....
That's kinda the same position I'm in. she wanted a model done - chatted to me about the ins and outs of it. showed me a scan of the colour changes she had made etc etc. Its due back to her by August and yet I haven't heard from her that its been sent yet ...
Will see if I can pester her on her blog over the weekend.
The one I'm supposed to do is for the September Online show. Its most unusual for her to be AWOL this long. I do hope nothing is terribly wrong. I'll keep on trying to get through to her. Let you know if I do
I see we are about 70 lighter over there in BAPXS...
Um one of those will be me! I left after Claire set up the other group :-)
56 to be precise LOL...and I aten't done yet.
It's so much quieter over there today than yesterday ... what a difference!
So Claire did you remove any of the johnny-come-lately posters? Or any of the annoying ones?
Or just the literal - haven't posted even once since joining?
A few of the ones who joined during the BoInk early days. A whole bunch who were modded since day one and that's all.
Jackie goes any moment. Not a peep out of her.
Teegs went from working 4 days a week to 6. She's been tired, cranky and not much fun to be around. We've finally hired a person to replace me on my 'old shift', so if I'm REALLY lucky, I just might get two days off this week. Add to that, an revisit of "Anna's Revenge" that I'm just now beginning to get over and, well, you get the picture. Claire's texted me some, but I think we've finally figured out that I'm not getting all the ones she sends. We've done a bit better this week.
I hope you'll allow me to join. I truly don't mind being the butt of all the non-stitching jokes, but only when they come from people who might actually care about me. BAPXS grew to the point that I couldn't even begin to keep up with it. I'm appalled to admit that I've deleted literally thousands of posts unread, simply because I have to sleep sometime!
I'll go post the most recent 'excitement' so you can see what life had been like around here!
Eeep Teegs! I hope things calm down for you
Teegs, if you scroll about halfway back up this blog, you'll see the purple box to join the Santuary Lounge. Hope to see you there!
So - is anyone else reallllllyyy annoyed that people are offended by Rule #5, and think they need to come yammer on about why they are offended that anyone else is offended??? Do some people live their lives in a constant state of being offended or look constantly for something to be offended about??? How many times can you put the word offended into a paragraph before it loses all sense of meaning??? The girl I work with is like that - offended by smells, sounds, other people's makeup and hairstyles. Frankly, it's too much wasted energy, when it's so much easier to just ignore the little stuff....
Yep, I can't believe 3 people, that I know of, have quit the group over this. Weird! It isn't that big a deal in my opinion. And they obviously didn't read all the posts either because it was clearly stated that it didn't pertain to religious stitching like Noah's Sub - that is stitching!! My husband and I had a go round about it too because I told him about the new rule and I thought it would help keep the 'flames' down a bit. He threw a fit and wanted me to leave the group. I said WHAT!! I happen to agree with Claire's/mod's decision. He is religious and political in extremes most of the time so it struck him as unfair on 2 counts. Our country is based on religion - it's even on our money and that it is their freedom to put it in their signatures. I argued no one wants religion shoved at them and that this is a stitching group not anything else. We agreed to disagree. LOL! I couldn't believe even he went off on such a little bity thing. Geesh!
Frankly, we expected a bunch of them to leave because of it. BUT - if they can't let go of something like tag lines that have nothing to do with our hobby, then I don't know...
Karen, I'm pretty sure it has to do with the fact that so many people today are so self-centred they can't really live with little deficiencies anymore.
Not sure if I will have to feel concerned by it, too, because we mainly set up the rule because we actually felt offended, LOL!
On the other hand we also have a healthy portion of humour...
Err.... it's not. Not really. It was founded with freedom of religion in terms that everyone is entitled to practice their preferred religion.
AND (besides the fact that Jefferson was an atheist) the separation of church and state was the most important article in the constitution. Boy, would your founding fathers be *offended* today!
Read about when they showed the original text of the American constitution to by-passers in Florida as a petition and tried to collect signatures? That was in the early 80s and boy, did they get replies! There were people thinking that they'd NEVER sign this, because it was a communist rubbish text. It was assumed that most average Americans don't have much knowledge about the original constitution.
Unfortunately, I think that you're right about the US Constitution, Mariann. I've had some really interesting conversations with folks recently about what's actually in there.
And you also mentioned what I was going to say to Scott - two of the most basic pieces of the foundation of this country were the freedom to worship as one pleases (or doesn't please) - no actual mention of religion - and the separation of Church and State - a pretty direct slap at England and some of what happened there. (No offense to my british friends, of course!)
I was annoyed the first time I saw Gail post with that signature line; I guess I got to the point I could overlook it, but it did strike me as pushing her view of religion. I truly don't care who/what/how anyone believes, but all I ask is that you don't try to "convert" me. I love some of the rational and educational conversations that we've had about some of the religions I'm not all that familiar with, but what I most appreciate about those particular conversations is that they haven't pushed anything as the "right" or "only" way.
As far as I am aware - the *only* people who have left the group have made sure we know how offended they are on the way out.
No-one has left quietly ..... we have to all be made aware of how much they are martyring themselves for their faith .....
Stupid stupid sheep.
One final comment - notice how its only *some* Christians who have left. I know we have Muslims and various flavourings of wicca/Pagans in the group and I don't see any of them leaving .....
And a few other flavors of Christians, as well that haven't left...
And for that I'm very grateful because some of them are my friends right here !!!
I'm not very insightful most of the time, I find myself lost through most of the talk. Let's just call a spade a spade, I didn't pay attention in school and never really did well in the educational aspect of school. I was raised Catholic and to be honest I think it's great to hear about other things and now that I'm older I find myself wanting to learn about tons of other things. I've never understood people being offended so easily. To many other things to deal with in life. Growing up I was one that never really fit it; so I guess I may just have a thicker skin than those who are offended by almost everything. People have different opinions and beliefs, I learned that early on in life. That's what makes conversations interesting (as long as you keep an open mind during the conversation) to me. Otherwise it's a whole conversation of I agree, how much fun can that be all the time? Okay.........I got rather long winded, hope I didn't bore to many people. lol Sorry if I did. :)
Not at all sweetheart - thank you for adding your two cents in - I really like the more people joining in and giving their perspective. The more the merrier as long as, as you say, we respect each other's points of view :) And I completely understand yours :)
See - and that was so much of what I was missing on BAPXS, that I think we've got back in the Lounge. We could discuss things, learn from each other and then agree that we all liked each other even though (or maybe because) we aren't identical in our opinions and feelings.
Too bad we weren't in school together, Shawn. I'm like you; I can't quite understand people who get offended so easily. To me, getting that wound up over things that aren't really important sucks up too much energy I could use in other things, and be happier while I'm doing them!
Well, all I can say after reading the last digest to come through: in the immortal words of Motley Crue, "Don't go away mad, just go away".
It's kind of like an argument I have with my boss every so often. Everyone in my group can agree that we have some "issues" with the engineering and program management groups in our division; as we are in charge of actually getting production done, it's always us that has to deal with their lack of follow-through/attention to detail/etc. Also, we are in two different states (or 3 on a couple of projects), so we really have a lot of "Us vs. Them" in our day to day. Well, my boss is the absolute king of Political Correctness. He is also very conscious of the "social structure" of our workplace.
Since me and other girl I work with are about the bottom rung of the group, we are often the two whose opinions and requests are completely disregarded, even when we are 100% in the right. I cannot tell you how many times one of us has a valid concern about the way something is about to happen or has happened (they like to try to do a lot without our knowledge - like after 6:00 at night when they know we've gone for the day), and though we even have the procedures written and in place to back us up, we always seem to just let them slide with this one, because we need to get it done or whatever - and I can always fix it later. It's 2 minutes of our time now, but we aren't "allowed to touch their stuff", which often means hours to fix later, if it is even fixable. Okay, job security for me - but that's not even true; the people in the other locations are safe, not us.
So, it usually boils down to the fact that it is okay for me to be offended by the lack of professional courtesy and engineering discipline, even if what they are doing is documented as being wrong, and that fact that my boss will NOT stand up for either of us, even if we are correct, if he thinks the person is higher up the food chain and is sensitive to criticism. It just pisses me off; my concerns don't rate his support, and it creates more stupid-work for me, where if I had been involved at the beginning, it would have been easily corrected and no problems now or in the future. He'll agree with me all day long - and then do nothing. I am ready for the world to be done with PC - it's a waste of time and energy, and really, where has it gotten us????
I think people need to find better things to be offended about. The rules are the rules, deal or prepare for the consequences - a piece of advice I would like to extend to the family of the kid killed by the roller coaster here this past weekend when he KNOWINGLY climbed over the 2 (not 1, but 2) fences, clearly marked DO NOT ENTER - DANGER and then got decapitated. I'm sure that will end up coming out of my pocket somehow, some day in the not too distant future....
And we're also not the ones using the religious sig lines.....
;-)
All of you go read Laura's blog entry today. She is so bang on about all of it. I love her to pieces and am so proud she came out and said what she had to say...It made my morning as I expected more gloom and doom.
Ooh..before I forget...Gail...did anyone ever notice her email address....the word in the middle is what she did a whole pile of..."Gail SQUAWK Jones"...oh please....
I was so tempted yesterday to just post to the group "I am an atheist, possible Wiccan, and proud of it. Come join the dark side, it won't hurt you"...but I didn't.
I also was even more tempted to exercise MY right to choose and that would have been the closure forever of BAPXS.
So you mean I did good by not publicly pointing these people at one of my finishes:
http://gothtigger.multiply.com/photos/album/71/2008_Finished_pieces#5
Goodness - I leave for a weeks vacation and miss all the drama. Fill me in!
Post a Comment